Updated: Antivirus firms "short-changing" customers
By Nicole Kobie
Posted on 3 Dec 2010 at 07:00
Two leading security firms have been accused of ripping off customers by cutting short their antivirus subscriptions after upgrading to different versions of the software.
AVG and Symantec are offering their own customers discounts on subscriptions via email or pop-ups, but the new subscriptions start immediately, "short-changing" users who had months left on their existing deal, according to a report by Which? Computing.
“I don’t think many people are aware that it happens,” Which? technology editor Matt Bath told PC Pro. “It just catches people unawares. And it’s unnecessary. It makes the company extra money by what is effectively a bit of a back door unfortunately.”
It makes the company extra money by what is effectively a bit of a back door unfortunately
AVG and Symantec are the only firms in the security industry who treat loyal customers in such a way, he said. “We looked at all of the major software vendors, including BitDefender and McAfee, and none of them are doing this,” Bath said. “Lots of others, such as Panda and McAfee, when you upgrade to a new subscription, will extend your current subscription.”
Bath said both Symantec and AVG “unashamedly” owned up to the practice, and said they had no plans to change their ways, instead advising their customers to upgrade as close as possible to the end of the subscription.
However, the pair actively send out emails and pop-up messages that encourage customers to upgrade immediately. “The trouble is they’re being sent out many months in advance of people’s end of subscription,” Bath said.
The practice is legal and part of the companies’ policies. “It’s something the companies have pointed out is in their terms and conditions, but we think that’s buried away a little too much for people,” Bath said.
“Either these companies should stop doing it or they should make it absolutely clear that it’s going to be cancelling out the remaining time on their current subscription," he said. "We think that people will be less likely to upgrade, which might not be as good for business for them, but it is much better customer service.”
AVG and Symantec response
The two firms have now denied the claims. Symantec said the Which? report is misleading, as its customers won't lose any subscription time when they renew their current product or download a new version of the product.
"If a customer chooses to renew an existing product subscription, the renewal period is added to the time remaining on the customer’s existing subscription," a spokesperson said.
Upgrading to a different product will restart the subscription time, but Symantec stresses it warns customers first. "If a customer chooses to purchase an upgrade product offering additional security features and more comprehensive protection, the new upgrade subscription will begin when installed and activated, and time remaining from the customer’s previous product subscription is not added to the new upgrade product subscription."
Dan Nadir, senior director of consumer products at Symantec, added: “In some cases we make discounted offers to our users for different products. If the user says they would like to move to a different product, we give them a discount and we clearly tell them that this is a different product with a new subscription. You don’t lose your existing subscription: if, for example, you have two months left, you can still use those months, for example by putting that product on a different PC.”
Tony Anscombe, a spokesperson for at AVG, said the Which? article was incorrect. “The article is inaccurate — I can categorically state that it’s wrong," he told PC Pro. If you have a licence that expires on 15 December, and you renew it today, your new licence will run to 15 December 2011. We have a team here working to get the article corrected, with documentary evidence, so we can show that what’s been reported is not the case.”
From around the web
Vote with feet
Legal or not, it is bad practice. Is PC Pro going to be complicit or is it going to update its review of these packages?
By mnj_lim on 3 Dec 2010 
AVG are increasingly alienating 'customers'
I'm a long time user of AVG products, both AVG Free on some machines and paid versions on others.
Not only are AVG displaying popups advertising their new version of AVG Free, they are practically ramming them down users throats with pops appearing every day (despite what AVG claim).
'Promotional periods' now appear to run sequentially too, so when one set of pops finish after two weeks or so, the next ones start immediately.
I know AVG have to promote their wares but this is just becooming nagware and I am seriously considering removing it from my and other PCs I support.
I wouldn't even mind upgrading but the new version slowed my machine to a complete stop and I had to uninstall it just to get my machine back.
By mviracca on 3 Dec 2010
Re: AVG are increasingly alienating 'customers'
Agreed: my laptop and desktop, being a few years old, have slowed down considerably since upgrading to AVG 2011. I removed it, installed MS Security Essentials and they're much more responsive now.
Mind you, probably Norton, McAfee et al aren't any better in this sense.
By luca_leonardi on 3 Dec 2010
Who is misleading who?
"If a customer chooses to renew an existing product subscription, the renewal period is added to the time remaining on the customer’s existing subscription,"
No, Symantec, that's not what Which? was claiming. Considering Symantec releases new versions (not just updates) on an almost annual basis they are positively encouraging people to cut short their subs. It's shameful.
It's all bloatware these days anyway. I don't want bells and whistles, I want my security to be unobtrusive so i can get on with using my computer instead of having to nurse it.
By colsmith on 3 Dec 2010
I've used MS security eseentials for a couple of Years now.It's small , lightweight and does it's job.Stopped Using AVG which was causing me problems.
By Jaberwocky on 3 Dec 2010
PC Pro to flex its muscle
All PC Pro has to do is include this conn in its review summary. Tick in the box to vendors who do not do this. Im sure the magazine has such power they will soon change their ways.
By NickByrne2 on 3 Dec 2010
PC Pro to flex its muscle
All PC Pro has to do is include this conn in its review summary. Tick in the box to vendors who do not do this. Im sure the magazine has such power they will soon change their ways.
By NickByrne2 on 3 Dec 2010
AVG Clarifies Information in Which? Report on Billing Practices
AVG Clarifies Information in Which? Report on Billing Practices
AVG today spoke with representatives of Which? Computing to clarify concerns raised by a recent Which? Computing report claiming consumers who updated early were essentially double charged for the period between the actual renewal date and the required renewal date. The confusion is the result of incorrect data that was provided to Which? Computing by AVG. AVG regrets the confusion this has caused for our customers.
The Which? report states incorrectly that customers of the paid-for version of AVG could lose time on their existing subscription when renewing prior to the expiration date.
If a customer renews an AVG product at any point before expiry, the start date of the renewal is only from the original expiry date, and this has always been AVG’s position.
While AVG’s position on renewals confirms that the system already in place is the correct one, the Which? Computing report does highlight consumer uncertainty around renewals for our paid-for version and we are grateful for them in doing this. AVG is taking steps to ensure that it is entirely clear that product renewals ahead of the expiry date start from the original expiry date and not before.
AVG has been offering a market-leading free product to millions of customers for more than 10 years. The company’s mission has long been to provide customers with high end security tools at no charge. The majority of AVG customers use our product for free, and this allows them to try a very robust anti-virus product without ever having to make a purchase.
By AVGTechnologies on 3 Dec 2010
Re: AVG Comment
Spheres
By matbailie on 3 Dec 2010
Bargeo
It seems the AVG spokesperson fails to understand the complaint or deliberately chooses to ignore it.
The 'Which' report specifically states that the rip-off occurs when someone UPGRADES to a different version not when simply renewing the subscription for the version already in use.
Geo.
By Bargeo on 4 Dec 2010
AVG aren't doing anything wrong it is industry wide standard practice
The whole article above is way too vague about the main point here. The extra cost is minimal and is offset if you buy via an 'upgrade' deal. It only happens if you switch from AVG Antivirus Pro to AVG Internet Security which are two separate products. Kaspersky do the same thing. You are not renewing a product when upgrading to a different one entirely. That is why the upgrade price is less than the full product price to take this into account. AVG and the like aren't going to grant Antivirus users free full licences to Internet Security instead because they change their minds after purchase. There is always going to be a charge for the extra elements of protection etc.
As for new versions of the same product, in the past when I have used AVG Antivirus and they have released a new build say 9 instead of 8, they have supplied a new product activation code to allow free migration under my existing licence.
By mr_chips on 4 Dec 2010
Don't defend it, just don't do it!
There is no defence to practices such as this. Discounts are often available without having a product to upgrade from, and it's not the extra charge for extra protection that is the issue here - there's nothing wrong with that - it's the fact that users are losing part of the original subscription they paid for. If businesses were upfront about such practices we wouldn't even be having this debate.
By coolcity on 5 Dec 2010
Users are not losing any part of the original subscription they paid for!
There isn't any short-changing with AVG license operation.
1year Renewal - adds new period to your existing one
Upgrade to higher level of protection (AV PRO -> Internet security) - changes your product but it hasn't any impact on your expiration date (New product expires in a same day as your previous one because it's only upgrade without renewal)
Renewal&Upgrade - adds new period to your existing one AND upgrades your product.
Bozzi
By BozziPhilson on 6 Dec 2010
When is a discount not a discount
So it appears that the constant nags offering a discount are just a scam. They are not really offering a discount for a repeat customer but to compensate for the short changing that takes place.
Loyal customers deserve to be treated better than cash cows.
By Manuel on 6 Dec 2010
AVG Policies
There has been a video added to Youtube which completely clarifies all of AVG's policies regarding Renewal, Increase, and Upgrade.
The article above is completely wrong, you don't lose any time on your AVG license for any of the three.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyXBOgIQca0
By AVG_Rob on 6 Dec 2010
Trend Micro U.S. Class Action
A class action law suit alleging these subscription cutting-short practices was filed in the U.S. See www.DefectiveTech.com
By AntiVirtual on 30 Jan 2012
Trend Micro U.S. Class Action
A class action law suit alleging these subscription cutting-short practices was filed in the U.S. See www.DefectiveTech.com
By AntiVirtual on 30 Jan 2012
Trend Micro U.S. Class Action
A class action law suit alleging these subscription cutting-short practices was filed in the U.S. See www.DefectiveTech.com
By AntiVirtual on 30 Jan 2012
Trend Micro U.S. Class Action
A class action law suit alleging these subscription cutting-short practices was filed in the U.S. See www.DefectiveTech.com
By AntiVirtual on 30 Jan 2012
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