Apple "refuses to repair smokers' Macs"

Weird

A more practical and less absurdly PC reason would be that the smoke particles damage the harddrives and other components, shortening the life of the PC.

So "smoking can seriously damage your mac" would be a fair statment and a reason to invalidate the warranty in the same way you would with water damage and other self-inflicted hardware failures.

What next? "Apple won't fix the iPhone I threw out the car window because they said I shouldn't smash it!" Oooh, those monsters!

By cheysuli on 23 Nov 2009

Seen this in a PC

I've seen one extreme example of how smoking damages your PC's health when repairing a computer owned by a colleague who has a 60+ a day. The tar residue on his MoBo had resulted in the shorting of a single chips pins which effectively disabled his PC, after cleaning the tar away with some surgical spirit the computer fired up without trouble.

By skarlock on 23 Nov 2009

@Skarlock - sounds like he must have been smoking the PC - Are you sure it was your colleague who was smoking and not the PC?

I mean its rather absurd to believe that a large amount of tar can build up on a mobo - was the pc not ventilated?

By nicomo on 23 Nov 2009

Hopefully the lady who couldn't get her son's Mac repaired because he is a smoker has now told her son to smoke outside the house in future!

Presumably by extension, garages will refuse to repair cars that have been smoked in?

By halsteadk on 23 Nov 2009

@nicomo

Perhaps not so absurd. Static electricity build up may attract smoke particles? I don't know, I'm just putting forward a possible explanation.

By jgwilliams on 23 Nov 2009

@nicomo

I regularly work on laptops and desktops which have large build ups of tar on the fan units (lovely brown sticky substance) and I have no doubt that this also builds up on the PCBs.
Just check out the white paint work of a smokers house, it sticks to everything!
Whether Apple is correct to refuse to is a different matter. If the fault was caused by the build up then I would say it is a chargeable repair. However the nicotine is held in the tar and if the technician is gloved this would pose no threat. Can you get anti-stat gloves?

By DarrellJF on 23 Nov 2009

Can't say I blame them

Like Darrell, I open my fair share of PCs. Lately I have ramped up my cleaning - not to make the PCs go better especially, but because I was becoming increasingly convinced that what collects inside a PC in home or office use could well pose a bit of a health hazard. These days I tend to whack the Dyson straight into the case the instant it's opened, and then swab off things I intend to be fiddling with, using a dampish cloth doused with Windowlene (which seems to evaporate away and do no harm I can readily detect). The amount of fluff and nastiness I collect in the little vacuum, and on the cloth, is all I really need to see.

(and yes - computers in normal use are pretty much continuous-running vacuum cleaners, themselves)

By Steve_Cassidy on 23 Nov 2009

vacuum?

I used to use a vacuum cleaner for clearing dust - until I was cleaning out the fireplace (yes, I still burn stuff for heat) and saw the sparks coming off the end of the hose Actually, I heard them at first, it was that loud. Have a care with those, Steve

By greemble on 23 Nov 2009

Speaking as a (recent) ex smoker...

... this is the biggest load of pony I've read in a long time! I've been directly inhaling nicotine for 25 years. I'm still ingesting it using lozenges in my attempt to wean myself off the habit. And I'm still here, in reasonably good health.

I cannot believe secondary exposure to cigarette smoke is as bad for you as they make out (whoever 'they' are).

This is just a weasel excuse for Apple (and presumably other companies will follow suit if they get away with it) to get out of their contractual obligations.

I don't dispute what others have said above about the residues getting into the PC. But I should think in this age of "smoking is evil" Apple probably quite rightly thought they'd stand more chance with the "we can't expose our engineers to this poison" excuse than anything else.

Ridiculous.

By john_sn on 23 Nov 2009

Speaking as a (recent) ex smoker...

... this is the biggest load of pony I've read in a long time! I've been directly inhaling nicotine for 25 years. I'm still ingesting it using lozenges in my attempt to wean myself off the habit. And I'm still here, in reasonably good health.

I cannot believe secondary exposure to cigarette smoke is as bad for you as they make out (whoever 'they' are).

This is just a weasel excuse for Apple (and presumably other companies will follow suit if they get away with it) to get out of their contractual obligations.

I don't dispute what others have said above about the residues getting into the PC. But I should think in this age of "smoking is evil" Apple probably quite rightly thought they'd stand more chance with the "we can't expose our engineers to this poison" excuse than anything else.

Ridiculous.

By john_sn on 23 Nov 2009

Hmmm... pressing refresh seems to have posted that again. Sorry! (Why's there no delete option?)

By john_sn on 23 Nov 2009

Wimps!

Apple (and Americans) never cease to amaze me with their wussiness. Where is their frontier spirit?

By Lacrobat on 23 Nov 2009

Media stunt.

Apple must be so desperate for the media attention to result in media stunts at customers expense.

Come-on, I bet some of the engineers are smokers.

Surly they solider electronic components almost every day, eat doughnuts, drink lots of coffee. Far higher risk to your health.

By Tibbs on 23 Nov 2009

Smokers deserver it

Smokers should pay the price of their disgusting habits.

For years, they got away with polluting the hair, clothes and eyes (not to mention the lungs) of their co-workers and fellow pub-goers, and they didn't give a rat's arse.

This is small payment for their sins.

By BrownieBoy6 on 23 Nov 2009

@BrownieBoy6

You're serious right? Do you even care that what you wrote is a pile intolerant poo? Thought so.

By c6ten on 24 Nov 2009

To Hell With APPLE!

I am so sick of hearing the whining of the Apple crowd. If it was a normal PC, you could fix the damn thing yourself. If you want a good MAC, build the damn thing yourself using a motherboard that is compatible with OSX and buy a copy of the software from Apple. I ran OSX on my Dell laptop and it kicked the crap out of my friends Mac which cost him three times as much. People have to realize you get what you pay for and Apple is not yet ready for the masses. If you believe the hype and BS from Apple's marketing, you should not have to take it in to be repaired because they claim to not have any problems that PC's have. You know the commercials that lie to you. PC's break down, so Mac's should not if the logic in the commercials prevails! You want to think different, don't let apple do it for you, run Linux or the dreaded Windows platform, which XP is still the best and most stable version if you think about all the crappy hardware people install into a Wintel machine and it somehow still manages to use it pretty damn well!

By M0dK1nG on 24 Nov 2009

pc smokers

This is just another anti-Apple article on the internet hoping to start a flame war (and no, I'm typing this on a Dell/Win XP machine). For those of you defending the smokers, you've probably never opened your own computer before. Go ahead and do a search on the internet and you will get to see what cigarettes do to your computer. Please don't take the side of someone who gets mad because a tech doesn't want to touch their filthy, toxic computer. People, especially consumers, need to get over their extremely bloated false sense of entitlement.
@Lacrobat,@Tibbs: I think you're both being a little too prejudice toward Apple and especially Americans.

By shayulghul on 24 Nov 2009

pc smokers

This is just another anti-Apple article on the internet hoping to start a flame war (and no, I'm typing this on a Dell/Win XP machine). For those of you defending the smokers, you've probably never opened your own computer before. Go ahead and do a search on the internet and you will get to see what cigarettes do to your computer. Please don't take the side of someone who gets mad because a tech doesn't want to touch their filthy, toxic computer. People, especially consumers, need to get over their extremely bloated false sense of entitlement.
@Lacrobat,@Tibbs: I think you're both being a little too prejudice toward Apple and especially Americans.

By shayulghul on 24 Nov 2009

Toxicity

Just how many people, from the lowliest miners to the overpaid techs, who contribute to the manufacturing of Computers/Phones/TV's are exposed to extremely toxic substances regularly in the course of their employment?

And, of course, it's okay to have three year olds dismantle a scrapped PC on a rubbish tip in Calcutta but a gloved-up and masked ponce from the first world can't risk his/her life replacing a faulty part. Best send it off to a third-world rubbish tip.

By Glovepuppet on 24 Nov 2009

Toxicity continued...

Secondary tobacco smoke is so bad for you they banned it in the work place (and any other public place). Fair enough. But given the choice, which would you rather inhale? Tobacco smoke or car-exhaust fumes?

Think of that next time you see those guys in multi-storey carparks who wash the cars.

Secondary tobacco smoke bad for my left foot.

By john_sn on 24 Nov 2009

Secondary tobacco smoke bad for *you* my left foot.

By john_sn on 24 Nov 2009

john_sn

While your on your pro-smoking rant....
I applaud the banning of smoking in public places.
I could tollerate the second hand smoke but it made my hair, my clothes and everythibng else STINK!
You might not not care that much about how others percieve your selfishness but that's that! How would you like it if people came up to you and sprayed you with SH!T everytime you went to the pub? no? thought not.

By darkhairedlord on 24 Nov 2009

@ darkhairedlord

LOL, I don't deny it smells, but it was banned on the pretext that secondary smoke is bad for your health. I'm not convinced.

I agree, however, that it's making it much easier to give up smoking, as I'm not exposed to it in the pub.

Talking of smelling. My sense of smell is much better now. Good grief people smell! Will some of you take a bath please!

By john_sn on 24 Nov 2009

Chill Pill time!

to Greemble: on the day when I can't tell the difference between an open fire, and a computer, I'll be sure to remember your words of wisdom. To the rest - it's pretty clear that Nicotine doesn't especially help with emotions like tolerance and understanding, if these comments are any guide: I don't think we can safely say that deposited Nicotine is as safe as long term inhalation, nor that Nicotine is all you get exposed to in a smoker's PC: what kills smokers is everything *else* about a cigarette, anyway - Nicotine is the narcotic part. Unless (so I'm told) you allow that substance into your alimentary tract via your non-barking end, in which case, it *can* be lethal.

In any case, I don't care about lethality. I care about irritation - why put up with it?

By Steve_Cassidy on 24 Nov 2009

Static

Steve_Cassidy - Ok, after you've fried your motherboard though static discharge, you can explain the difference to me.

BTW, Nicotine is a stimulant, not a narcotic. Lethal dose of nicotine (adult human) is between 40 and 60 mg. Within the blood concentrations greater than 5 μg/ml may be fatal

By greemble on 24 Nov 2009

Pathetic excuse

I can see a case for "invalidates the warranty", but not to repair it AT ALL is unbelievable.
How to lose potential customers at a stroke. Whatever happened to customer service?

By realist on 24 Nov 2009

@realist

Uhhh.. What happened to supplier rights? Since when do customers get more than what they paid for? Customer Service is a privilege that the supplier decides to grant to their customers.

By Eegras on 24 Nov 2009

@Eegras

..... or not, as shown currently by companies such as Mesh and Acer?

By mech1 on 24 Nov 2009

Customer Service

I thought that was included in the price

By greemble on 24 Nov 2009

The way of the future

As most computers will be used in smoke-free offices from now on, we may see a similar stand from other manufacturers in future.

To me it's obvious that if a computer is pulling 100's of litres of air through the case, it's going to get coated with cigarette deposits.

Smokers seem to think their lungs are immune to the same environment.

By Stiggy on 25 Nov 2009

Personal experience

About 20 years ago I got my first job working in a small office which was full of smokers (no laws or rules back in those days!)

Whenever I had to open up a PC (which were big tower cases back then), the insides were absolutely filthy, covered in a layer of sticky grime and smoke residue.

Years later, I'm working in a hospital informatics department, and whenever I need to open up a PC they're clean, if a little dusty, but more importantly without any sticky residue.

I'm unsure as to wether this residue can cause or be the cause of component failure within the machine. But working on a PC from a 'smoking environment' isn't a very nice task.

By onlinesimon on 26 Nov 2009

What?

"tobacco residue inside the machines poses a health risk"

What about all the carcinogenics on the PCB from the manufacturing processes and of course the substances used to make components?

By AndiC_UK on 26 Nov 2009

Good For Apple

I don't use Apple & couldn't say whether it causes HW problems, or not, but it's irrelevant.
Smoking is a Neanderthal habit, though I suspect they would have been cleaner. I say good for Apple, if it protects its workers from the selfish, ignorant and potentially dangerous effects of the activities of smokers.

By Klobba on 26 Nov 2009

Let's stick to the facts

@Steve_Cassidy: "In any case, I don't care about lethality. I care about irritation - why put up with it?"

If that's Apples position then fine, but I'm fairly certain that, by law, they have to put that clause in the agreement.

I can see from all the posts here that it's easy to get involved in the minutiae, but the real debate is, surely, whether Apple can amend an agreement on the fly.

As I say, all it would take to resolve the issue would be for Apple to issue an amended agreement with the sale of its equipment. Then potential customers could decide whether to take the goods or not. In other words, it would give people yet another reason to avoid what must be one of the most restrictive IT companies in the world.

By 6tricky9 on 26 Nov 2009

Saturated Fats

.... and in ground breaking news Apple refuse to work on fat people's computers due to saturated fats. Meanwhile fatist people shout "hurrah" and say "fatties deserve it"

By MarkWall1966 on 26 Nov 2009

An Apple a day keeps the Doctor away

...and this doctor (who is totally anti-smoking, by the way) will be keeping well away from Apples. Call me an Apple-basher if you like, but I find this holier-than-thou attitude quite off-putting. Next, presumably, customers will have to refrain from wearing after-shave, just in case the techician is allergic to it.

By richardpenney1 on 26 Nov 2009

I can see the point from both sides

As an ex smoker who used to smoke profusely while using my computer years ago I can sort of understand. Being on the computer seems to bring out the 'urge' in smokers.

However, as a person who makes a living repairing PC's I can say that sometimes I get units in that I can barely stand to be in the same room with, let alone repair them. Just last month I had one in that was really badly blocked up with sticky dust and tar and it stank to high heaven. Even worse when switched on in a closed up room and the stench of old cigarettes and unclean house gets pushed out from the exhaust fans. It was so bad that it was nauseating.

By complus1 on 26 Nov 2009

An Apple a day keeps the Doctor away

...and this doctor (who is totally anti-smoking, by the way) will be keeping well away from Apples. Call me an Apple-basher if you like, but I find this holier-than-thou attitude quite off-putting. Next, presumably, customers will have to refrain from wearing after-shave, just in case the techician is allergic to it.

By richardpenney1 on 26 Nov 2009

I thought Macs didn't break?

By qwertyqwerty87 on 26 Nov 2009

polki

I think that all we can say with certainty here that it's probably dangerous to vacuum clean your fireplace when it's lit.......

By downview on 26 Nov 2009

BULL

This is a load of pure crap on Apple's part. M'thinks it's a POLITICAL statement rather than any genuine concern for the health of their employees. Their employees will get a much bigger load of toxins cleaning the sink in the employee lounge than they will from the TRACE amounts of toxins that may be deposited from second-hand cigarette smoke. I'm nor saying that second-hand smoke doesn't have toxins; only that by the time it's deposited onto the innards of a computer, the risk to humans is virtually zero.

By rlb918 on 24 Dec 2009