Dell: Linux returns a "non-issue"

Most of the returns are probably from PCworld.
you know, salesmen says "you'll need a copy of norton AV for that!"
"oh, it wont install it?, better have an XP one instead!"

By darkhairedlord on 14 Aug 2009

Tell me about it. They tried to sell me a laptop with a blu ray drive the other day. I pointed out that it didn't have a blu ray drive. The sticker on the laptop said selected models and the one they were showing me was not a selected model. PC World is useless and has no idea about PCs.

By TimoGunt on 14 Aug 2009

PC World

trying not to sound like a PC Pro fan boy here. but if you read this months issue of PC Pro it has some alarming statements from sales staff not just from PC world but most of the high street shops.

By SimonCorlett on 14 Aug 2009

Ah, I see the problem

I'm no Microsoft fan by any means, but I see an immediate issue with the statement that was made by Dell:

"We are not seeing any technical reasons for why they are returning Linux machines"

This sounds very much like he's only telling half of the story (as backed up by the last paragraph).

I can well believe that Dell is not getting returns for "technical" reasons, this means that the machines are not faulty. What Dell is probably seeing, and what Microsoft is probably using the number for, are people returning the machines within the statutory money back period because they either cannot get on with Linux, or because they didn't realize all of the things that they either can't do or need to do differently in Linux. For example, that most of the software that you can buy on the high street won't work on a Linux.

I also wonder how many people brought Linux netbooks and returned them only to buy a laptop instead. People who buy them because they are cheap expecting them to do what a laptop will do and then not only find that they are slow but also that they don't understand the OS because it is different from the one that they are used to.

I've run across no end of people buying cheap laptops and complaining because WoW won't run on them or runs badly because they didn't realize the difference between a laptop and a desktop, so there must be a fair few people who've brought netbooks thinking that they were suitable for laptop task and then returned them.

By Perfectblue97 on 14 Aug 2009

@perfectblue97 - Dell: "we don't see a significant difference between the return rate for Windows versus the rate for Linux"

You missed out the rest of the statement, which would suggest that Dell aren't quite seeing what you're implying?

By pbryanw on 14 Aug 2009

has any one succeeded in playing proper bought dvds with linux
or even getting a wifi conection with an atheros 5008 card via wpa-tkip

By invalidscreenname on 14 Aug 2009

has any one succeeded in playing proper bought dvds with linux
or even getting a wifi conection with an atheros 5008 card via wpa-tkip

By invalidscreenname on 14 Aug 2009

has any one succeeded in playing proper bought dvds with linux
or even getting a wifi conection with an atheros 5008 card via wpa-tkip

By invalidscreenname on 14 Aug 2009

@invalidscreenname

Yes, to the first instance, and I would suggest ndiswrapper for the second. You do need to know a little bit before you do either of those things, but with a little help from the linux community you should normally be fine.

By Penguat on 14 Aug 2009

You would expect those confident enough to buy without advice, ie at Dell, to know what they are buying, so its surprising that some had 'mis-bought'.
What would be more interesting is to know what the (dis)satisfaction rates are like after a few weeks/months. Do people 'embrace' Linux, or do they dump them on ebay if they are too late to return them?

By davidsoap on 15 Aug 2009

Pre-Installed Linux tends to work!

It is important to realise that this article is about Netbooks which come with Linux pre-installed. In this case Dell, Acer &c will have installed the a version which supports the machines sound, wireless Lan, webcam &c.

No Netbook comes with a DVD drive, so DVD playback should be a non-issue. One would expect to play videos downloaded from the internet, and these are in a format Netbooks can handle.
However, I do agree that purchasers of Linux based Netbooks may not be aware that the vast majority of software in PC World or any other shop will not run on Linux. If store staff had the confidence to say "don't worry, OpenOffice does all the things you need from (MS)Office"

By milliganp on 17 Aug 2009

Linux Returns

I literally can see why people might want to return the PC's with any versions of Linux (or TUX, in the US). One hears many great things about what linux does, but we never hear how hard it is to get to work around issues. We also never get advice from anyone if something does not work. I mainly hear "we don't support linux". Yes, some programs WILL NOT work on linux platforms, but most do not know of WINE, to run more Windows CD's, etc. This is gotten in the "add remove" portion of the menues.

I also know that people are not trained on this set of programs, which is different than Windows.

I also know that many glitches in the open source community prevent some drivers from being availible. Take my Haupauge 26xx PVR/ TV and radio capture card. Many people tod me to get "a4l" program, then to load in "mythTV" and "Mythbuntu." Yes, it is frustrating since those did not work. The Hauppauge comany gave no suggestions.

Also, I can also see that Dell does not have the latest version of my version of linux. they only offer 8.10, as a new version, to the date of this comment. The current is Ubuntu 9.04, and in less than 2 months, will be 9.10. Dell needs to catch up on their software offers.

I can easily see why people might possibly turn in the PC's with linux, since there are problems, too many workarounds that people do not know of, along with lack of OS software offered.

Yes, linux has it's own versions of software, but nobody can "decode" what version of the software in linux, is the similar of what they used in Windows.

NOTE: I am a current linux user, converted from Windows XP sp2 that went corrupt constantly. I gave it a chance, but still have some problems. However, I wanted to know about this software, where most may not have the drive that I do, to learn it.

By EmmGee on 18 Aug 2009

The Facts

Let's cut through the Microsoft hype and look at the facts. Asustek produced the first currently recognised netbook in 2007 with the EeePC 700 series. These netbooks *only* ran Linux (Xandros). The response by the public was so overwhelming that it not only took Microsoft by surprise, but also Asustek itself when it ran out of stock due to the huge demand.

The question is why did we not hear about netbook returns at this time -- it seemed as though people could not get enough of them. It was reported in this magazine that the OS was so user friendly that some people did not even realise that
they were using Linux.

I think the answer is that the Microsoft marketing machine had not prepared itself at that time. Remember that Microsoft had already stated that support would be withdrawn from XP, a statement they had to withdraw because Vista would not run on a netbook.

So, why are people so ready to believe a statement from a serial law breaker (Microsoft Word -- here we go again)? A statement that flies in the face of the facts.

By 6tricky9 on 20 Aug 2009

Atheros 5008

@invalidscreenname: the Linux kernel has had built in support for the Atheros 5008 for the last six months or so. It's called the ath9k driver. I have an Atheros 5008 working perfectly under a Linux based OS with WPA encription. It will also run with WPA2 if your router supports it.

By 6tricky9 on 20 Aug 2009

Playing encrypted bought DVDs in LINUX

@invalidscreenname

playing "proper bought dvds" as you call it or encrypted DVDs as I'd call them involves pressing just a few buttons buttons. Personally I haven't come across ANY Movie DVDs that won't play on Ubuntu Linux and I use several different versions. The file you need is libdvdcss2 (you may need to install the other non-free codecs as well. (Press Applications, Add/Install, click show all available applications then type a search for gstreamer-plugins and select those relevant like mp3, mp4 xvid,etc.)
The following is a link to the necessary file. Just download it. Double click and thats about it.

http://packages.medibuntu.org/pool/free/libd/libdv
dcss/libdvdcss2_1.2.10-0.2medibuntu1_i386.deb

Otherwise enable the the non-free repositories in Ubuntu and install from there.
Just a simple Google search would have told you the same thing and getting a wireless connection would, I'm sure, not be much harder. You can get help at the forums.

By Justin2007 on 20 Aug 2009

Playing encrypted bought DVDs in LINUX

@invalidscreenname

playing "proper bought dvds" as you call it or encrypted DVDs as I'd call them involves pressing just a few buttons buttons. Personally I haven't come across ANY Movie DVDs that won't play on Ubuntu Linux and I use several different versions. The file you need is libdvdcss2 (you may need to install the other non-free codecs as well. (Press Applications, Add/Install, click show all available applications then type a search for gstreamer-plugins and select those relevant like mp3, mp4 xvid,etc.)
The following is a link to the necessary file. Just download it. Double click and thats about it.

http://packages.medibuntu.org/pool/free/libd/libdv
dcss/libdvdcss2_1.2.10-0.2medibuntu1_i386.deb

Otherwise enable the the non-free repositories in Ubuntu and install from there.
Just a simple Google search would have told you the same thing and getting a wireless connection would, I'm sure, not be much harder. You can get help at the forums.

By Justin2007 on 20 Aug 2009

Playing encrypted bought DVDs in LINUX

Just on last thing. That particular link is for Ubuntu 9.04. If you want another version then visit the MediBuntu website.

By Justin2007 on 20 Aug 2009

Not what netbooks are for

If they were talking about returning Linux based laptops or desktops because they wouldn't run packaged windows software, then I would not be that surprised. A huge chunk of the buying public don't even know what Windows and Linux are, so would not understand that what they just bought won't do what they think it should.

However, we are talking about netbooks. They are small, slow and designed for a very limited set of features .. all built in. They do email, web and small documents, end of. That's what they are for. True they do the documents in a slightly different way to a Word enabled Windows box, but really not that different and they can easily import Word docs.

I would suggest that the people returning netbooks because they don't run Windows software have the wrong idea about what they are for in the first place.

By admered1 on 20 Aug 2009

EeePC

@6tricky9

You mention the rush to buy the EeePc, I was one of those people, as were nearly all of my work colleagues. As IT professionals and geeks the EeePC was a gift and cheap as well.

I have since passed mine on and am now using an Aver Aspire One, with the Linpus OS, bought from Tesco for £170. It's used for accessing email, Internet shopping etc. and means I can do it from anywhere in the house or garden. I have even been known to use it in bed when I get called out in the middle of the night rather than go downstairs to the office.

It gets more use these days than my main PC as it does what it does very well.

I agree with what others have said in that the biggest problem with Netbooks and Laptops running Linux are the buyers, most have no idea and little skill, the PC to them is just another gadget that they expect to work. It doesn't help that the people selling them seem to have little more knowledge than the buyers. Truly the blind leading the blind.

By njm1404 on 27 Aug 2009