Posted on August 19th, 2009 by Dave Stevenson
Why Outlook 2010’s conversation view doesn’t work
Let’s be clear: Outlook 2010 is good. Very good, actually. And, certainly, if you instructed me to write an email client I’d come back to you with a white box with “INBOX” written on the front in biro.
But that doesn’t mean it hasn’t been driving me up the wall.
Outlook 2010 tries to be all clever by bundling messages into “Conversations”. This is useful for when someone in the office CC’s everyone in on which pub to go to and you spend Friday afternoon battling a deluge of witty put-downs. In Outlook 2010 everything with the subject line “Let’s go to the pub!” is rolled into one conversation and you have to scroll through your inbox less.
Problem is, Outlook 2010 isn’t particularly clever when it comes to the science bit. Instead of being smart and looking at to whom an email has been sent, it simply grabs the subject line and lumps any subsequent email with the same subject line into the same conversation. So if you forward an email from a stupid person to a clever person and add a line saying “LOOK AT THIS MORON!”, Outlook will see the subject line and make it look like you’ve accidentally CC’d the idiot. I did this last week and nearly had a heart attack.
Take this screenshot. (These emails, by the way, are different to the one which nearly gave me an aneurism last week.) Greg Salmon does PR for Microsoft Office, Tim Danton is PC Pro’s editor. It looks to the untrained eye like they’re both CC’d in on an email with the subject “Office 2010”, but they’re not. It simply means I’ve sent them separate emails which Outlook has grouped into a conversation.
Microsoft claims Outlook 2010 is more intelligent than that. A spokesman reckons “the scenario of similar or exact subject lines has been accounted for by tracking the GUID [Globally Unique Identifier] of each message,” but I really can’t see it. Take the screenshot below as an example.
Naturally, this is less of a problem if you use nice, descriptive subject lines such as “Meeting on Monday the 25th to discuss the price of tea”, but I don’t. I send messages with stupid subject lines like “I’m…” and finish the rest of the sentence in the body of the email. Or I say things like “Meeting”, and suddenly Outlook thinks I’m taking part in a giant email conversation with 98 recipients.
Microsoft is keen to point out this isn’t the final product. “We are still working on this feature, and are planning improvements to our ability to differentiate conversations with the same subject line before Office 2010 ships”, said our friendly Microsoft spokesperson.
But it’s surprising that, even at this early stage – and remember this is the Technical Preview of Office 2010, it’s not even at Beta yet – the view is so far behind other conversation-threading systems already available.
For example, Gmail offers conversation threading as well, and the technology behind it sounds similar: “Gmail threading is determined by consistency within the subject headers and references headers of email. A subject header is commonly known as the subject line and a reference header appears in the “References” line within the original, raw message information,” according to the company.
That sounds a lot like the GUID that Microsoft’s talking about it but my inboxes don’t lie: Gmail is currently threading my conversations correctly, while Outlook 2010 is very hit and miss.
You can turn it off and arrange messages simply by the “To:” field like in the old days, but I don’t want to. I like the conversation feature. I use it in Gmail all the time and it’s brilliant, and I want it to be brilliant in Outlook 2010. Certainly the rest of the application is golden: searching is nearly instantaneous in my 5,000-strong inbox and I like how a business card pops up onscreen if you hover over an email address. But until Microsoft gets the conversation feature right I’ll be treading a lot more carefully in my emails.
Tags: conversation view, Microsoft Office 2010, Outlook 2010
Posted in: Microsoft Office 2010
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20 Responses to “ Why Outlook 2010’s conversation view doesn’t work ”
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August 19th, 2009 at 3:48 pm
I, for one, welcome our new email overlord!
August 19th, 2009 at 4:35 pm
So, it doesn’t actually follow conversations using the originator Ids and thread them accordingly
Shame, that was the most useful feature of the old mail clients on Linux and Windows, before Outlook came along…
It looks like Microsoft can’t learn old tricks.
August 19th, 2009 at 5:55 pm
Thanks for the feedback Dave – it’s great to see people getting to grips with Outlook 2010 and sharing their experiences of the new features we are adding to the product. Conversation View will continue to evolve in experience and accuracy between the current Technical Preview milestone and our public Beta later this year – hopefully we’ll have an opportunity to get your opinion on whether we’re closer to the mark at that time. If you haven’t already, I’d encourage you to “Send a Frown” to register your feedback directly with the engineering team.
August 19th, 2009 at 7:16 pm
So, basically, M$ is admitting it doesn’t do what they say it should be doing. M$ really are complete muppets.
August 20th, 2009 at 8:18 am
This is a technical preview which is not even at a public beta stage yet. If you are surprised some features don’t fully work, then I advise you wait until the RTM version is shipped.
August 20th, 2009 at 8:34 am
I did have a quite lengthy reply to this, but because I forgot to type in the Bl***Y recaptcha box it was thrown away.
General drift was there are message-ID and “in-reply-to” email headers for a reason, whats wrong with using them? Now to type in the stupid “jumping oyster” in the hope this doesn’t get lost.
August 20th, 2009 at 10:01 am
I signed up for the Technical Preview and have been running 2010 ever since. I have had exactly the same problem as Dave. The amount of old but unrelated mail that was grouped together was amazing. However, I fully accept this is early code so I haven’t let it bother me. New mail seems to be getting sorted correctly though. What would have been nice would have been the ability to mark messages as “unrelated” incase the Outlook engine is mistaken. Anyway, I sent feedback via the “frown / smilie” system.
On the whole though, it look and runs great.
August 20th, 2009 at 5:06 pm
PCPRO Authors and Bloggers:
What no women?
August 20th, 2009 at 5:08 pm
Sorry – wrong thread
August 20th, 2009 at 9:02 pm
Is this the technical preview you are talking about or someother version?
August 21st, 2009 at 8:06 am
Morning all,
David – Microsoft claims it’s using a GUID, but all I can see it doing is using subject lines.
Chris – A good point about sending a frown. Will do it today.
Alan – You’re quite right, this is the technical preview and it’s unreasonable to expect it to be perfect. I find it a bit surprising that such a major new feature of Outlook currently has such a major flaw, though.
Callum – that is stunningly ironic
Jon – it’s the technical preview.
September 29th, 2009 at 3:15 pm
I hate that they got rid of the toolbars. Conversation mode doesn’t work that well. Also you can’t move mail in IMAP mode with Gmail.
September 29th, 2009 at 4:17 pm
James – do you mean the “ribbon” at the top? I think that’s actually a pretty big improvement on what went before, which was a “here are nearly all the tools you need to get stuff done but not all of them.”
Now it’s “here are the tools you need to get specific things done”.
Also, I use Gmail’s IMAP mode with Outlook 2010 and moving messages between folders works fine for me. Fire off a sad face to Microsoft and see what happens.
September 29th, 2009 at 8:31 pm
Dave: Yeah the ribbon just isn’t working for me in Outlook. I like it when I’m composing emails but the main window works better with the toolbar. Also due to an error I tried recreating an IMAP account and cannot get it to deliver the mail to the older pst file it created just a week ago. It always creates a new one and delivers the mail to that one instead of the older one.
October 2nd, 2009 at 7:10 am
For work with outlook files I often use-ms outlook viewer.Software can a lot of features and has got free status.Moreover utility can convert your data to a *.pst file, that can be easily opened by any email client.
October 29th, 2009 at 6:47 pm
I’m trying out the Beta Build 4514 and the converstation view is still absolutely useless – and just as you describe.
At least you can turn it off in this version:
- View
- Converstations
- Untick “Show Messages in Coverstations”
This is such an obviously broken feature. I noticed it within about a minute of starting Outlook for the first time!
November 9th, 2009 at 10:02 am
[...] but not fine for generic subjects). Hopefully this will be improved in 2010 (though as of now, initial reports are not good). Still, in many ways it is far superior to the regular inbox view (and unlike Gmail, [...]
November 18th, 2009 at 11:41 am
[...] Conversation views allow you to track what was said and to whom, and when. It reads email to you like a story; starting off at the bottom and working its way through, adding each reply to the very top to keep your conversations to-and-fro organised and seamless. No longer will you have to depend on replies including the original message, even though some strongly disagree. [...]
November 20th, 2009 at 6:19 pm
It’s been like this for as long as I can remember since at least Outlook XP! Fix! Please!
February 5th, 2010 at 12:15 pm
Thanks for this great post but what are the file recovery methods that are used in 2010. please mention them in you next blog.